In this episode, we find out why Juniper Waller cares as much as she does, about what she does. She is a trauma-informed vocal embodiment coach and breathwork guide, helping folks step more fully into presence and speak truth to power. Juniper’s work is informed by a winding path; a background in holistic healing, social justice, work, music, and poetry. She comes from a long line of singer-songwriter empaths and fronts a band based out of Sacramento, California. She also has a cool, monthly, online, healing circle called Breathwork for Collective Liberation.
Has anyone ever commented about your voice? You are not alone. I've been there, and our guest has some insights into how the voice can be a vulnerable, deep dive into the self.
Juniper helps us understand voice-related trauma, shares her journey, purpose, and gives us actionable tips for our day-to-day lives and well-being.
Are you ready to learn and be inspired? Listen in to this episode.
Key Talking Points of the Episode:
Key Milestones of the Episode:
[02:32] Juniper’s background
[03:34] Getting to know Juniper and what she does
[12:45] What inspired Juniper to do what she does today?
[23:53] How does breathwork help people get more grounded?
[26:33] The breathwork process
[32:04] Why do we forget to breathe?
[41:40] What kind of mindset is helpful for those to care a lot?
[44:21] Juniper discusses possible pitfalls of empaths
[47:02] People who have impacted Juniper
[49:50] Juniper’s piece of advice
[52:27] What is the meaning of the term "lizard brain?"
[55:05] Tips to staying sane in isolation
[55:53] One thing Juniper has never done, but would like to try
Standout Quotes from the Episode:
“Singing is so vulnerable. Singing is so heart opening.”
“If you’re coming to someone, and you’re going to pay money and spend time on learning how to sing, you are ready, even if you don’t know consciously. What you’re asking for is like some serious deep diving into yourself.”
“When your voice is put down, it goes to like a really deep place. It feeds one of our deepest fears as people that we don’t deserve to be heard.”
“I believe that everybody’s creative and everybody benefits from having a creative practice, whether you share that with the world or not.”
“There are many people in recovery who care too much, and many of them kind of reach for external substances to kind of quell that passion.”
“With great power comes great responsibility.”
“Ignoring doesn’t really work and suppresses a lot of things.”
“Truly caring means we’re still connected to others.”
Resources Mentioned in the Episode:
The Artist’s Way- Julia Cameron*
Connect with Juniper Waller:
Breathwork For Collective Liberation
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Created, Produced, Hosted & Edited by: Randi Johns
Music by: Tefty & Meems
*Disclosure: Books denoted with an asterisk are hyperlinked to an affiliate program. We are a participant in that Bookshop.org affiliate program (at no extra cost to you). Bookshop.org is a website backed by the American Booksellers Association that lets consumers support independent bookstores across America by shopping online through affiliate pages on Bookshop’s website.
Randi: Hello, hello and welcome to today's episode of “You Care Too Much.” I'm your host, Randi Johns and I am so excited about the guest on this episode. We dive into all the juicy details on why this guest cares as much as she does about what she does. This is Juniper Waller, who is a trauma-informed vocal embodiment coach and breathwork guide, helping folks step more fully into presence and speak truth to power.
[00:00:43] I mean, whoa. I had no idea what that even meant, but it's awesome. Juniper's work is informed by the winding path of her past, with a background in holistic healing, social justice work, music, and poetry. She comes from a long line of singer/songwriter empaths and fronts a band out of Sacramento, California. She also has really cool monthly online healing circle called Breathwork for Collective Liberation. Stick around for details on that.
[00:01:18] Okay. I can't wait any longer to get to this episode, because there is so much to learn about just how much our wellness is tied to our voice and breathing. Spoiler; it's a lot.
[00:01:32] And we had so much fun while getting to the nitty gritty of why this woman cares so much. So, really quick, before we get into this episode, I wanted to take a second to ask you all if you wouldn't mind going over to iTunes and giving us a five-star rating, if you like what you're hearing. And maybe leaving a nice review that helps podcast listeners, like you, to find us so that we can connect over a community of caring.
[00:02:02] Thanks for being here. Thanks for giving a fuck. Now, new friends and old, it is my pleasure to introduce you to Juniper Waller.
[00:02:14] Hello, Juniper Waller! Welcome to “You Care Too much.”
Juniper: Hello. Thank you. Thanks for having me.
[00:02:22] So, so excited to have you here today and just a tiny a little background for anyone listening, Juniper is a trauma-informed vocal coach, and breathwork guide. She helps folks step more fully into presence and speak truth into power. That is huge. I mean, there's so many- I have so many questions already. That's so powerful. So, so I guess let's start with, can we dive a little bit more into that and understand more who Juniper Waller is? Where that came from and why you care so much?
[00:03:05] I mean, we're on the “You Care Too Much” podcast, which is sort of an ironic way for those of us who care a lot about a lot of things. Folks who, who give a fuck about things to, to talk about those things and where they came from and their mindset. So, yeah. Who are you Juniper?
[00:03:25] Juniper: Yes, I love it. I love the name of this podcast. I give way too many fucks. And have my whole life. And so, this, my business, really is, you know, my latest and hopefully long-term attempt at kind of putting like all this passion that I have to a good place. So yes, trauma-informed vocal embodiment coach and breathwork guide. I am coming at this work many years of studying the voice and being a vocal coach.
[00:04:01] I come from to this from being like a traditional singing teacher.
Randi: Okay. Okay.
Juniper: And it was through my work with a lot of my students of all kinds, you know, I've taught, grown men, grown women, grown- like everyone in between. I’ve taught kids, teenagers, all different kinds of people, professional singers, hobbyists, people who could hardly carry a tune at all, but just really wanted to, to sing.
[00:04:31] Right? And, and I've always really embraced every kind of student, because if you want to sing, that means you're ready for some major transformation. And that's just a rule of thumb. All voice teachers know that. Like, if you talk to any voice teach, they’ll be like, “Oh yeah.” If you come to me, you're ready for some change.
[00:04:52] Singing is so vulnerable. Singing is so heart opening. Right? And that's why, you know, the number one fear of Americans, like statistically speaking, is, is public speaking. So if you take that, put singing on that - that wasn't one of the choices - but like, I'm sure that would be even bigger for a lot of people as public singing.
[00:05:16] Public speaking on key, I guess?
[00:05:19] Right. Yeah. And so, but then at the same time, everyone loves to sing, you know, like that there's like singing apps that have millions of users and, you know, karaoke bars everywhere. So, it's like, and that, you know, I have my own thoughts on karaoke, right? Oh, okay. So, you'll sing if you're drunk, but, but-
[00:05:42] Randi: Interesting. Yeah, yeah or, or I guess, relegated to the shower, or the car.
Juniper: Right. That's what people always say. Do you sing? “Oh, only in the shower, or, oh, only when I've had a few beers.” Right? So, if you're actually coming to someone and you're going to pay money and spend time on learning how to sing, you are ready. Even if you don't know it consciously, what you're asking for is, like, some serious deep diving into yourself. But people never know, you know, really how deep it can get.
[00:06:15] Until they're in it. And that is kind of how I discovered what I really wanted to be doing. I love teaching, but the thing that made me most passionate about teaching voice were those moments where we kind of got deeper, under the surface of just, like, “I want to sing this song,” to what is your voice mean to you?
[00:06:39] And what is this bringing up in you and I, I had students- I've had so many students who have confided in me, without prompting, that there was a moment in their life where someone they trusted, whose opinion mattered to them, said something to them along the lines of, “your voice is annoying.”
Randi: Oh, yeah, been there.
[00:07:05] Juniper: And it hits so hard. It hits so hard in the gut, in the heart. It's often a parent or, you know, another kid at school, or a teacher. But so many people have had this experience of “your voice is annoying” or “stop singing” or-
Randi: Or you can't sing. Right?
[00:07:24] Juniper: Right. Absolutely. Or even just, you know, “stop talking.” Or I had student who got in a car accident as a kid and was singing and looking down and then literally had the wind knocked out of her. She didn't see it coming and she was singing. And so, it's like, there's so many ways that our relationship with our voice can become disturbed and that we can develop trauma around it. And it really sticks with people because the thing is, when your voice is put down, it goes to like a really deep place.
[00:08:01] It feeds one of our deepest fears, as people, that we don't deserve to be heard.
Randi: That is huge. That is- so really, you are doing some of the most vulnerable work with people. By digging into these things. I mean, do people, when they come to you even know- do they even know?
Juniper: No, they don't know. No, they don't. And that's something that I'm working on addressing right now in my messaging, because now that I've gotten more.
[00:08:35] transparent about, I want to help people do this transformational work, yeah, a lot of people don't know that that's something that they would benefit from. But the thing is whether you want to sing or not, you know, now I have clients that don't even care about wanting to sing. You know, it's a connection with yourself that so many people are missing.
[00:08:56] Right? And I'm helping people connect to a part of themselves that they can't connect to. Right? And we don't know that there's this part of us that we can't connect to until we start to do it. So, we might notice the symptoms of not being connected to that part of ourselves. And a lot of the time, those symptoms manifest through our voice.
[00:09:21] But then it's hard to like really put that into words and into meaning until you start diving in to your trauma around your voice. So many of my students would come to me and they just cry, you know, like, and, and I've had that. I've showed up at a new teacher's studio and started crying. The voice is just really, it's a window.
[00:09:45] It's just like this, this door to the shadow work. To pulling apart things about ourselves that we haven't really dove into yet. Just like, like, you know, any energy healing work. Right? So, then I also do breathwork because breathwork specifically the practice that I do, which is a three-part breath technique.
[00:10:07] That is just so heart-opening and voice-opening. Almost puts you in a bit of an altered state, safely. And just a really open place to dive into the work. That's kind of the modality that I use to get deeper with people. And then also I use meditation, visualization, journaling prompts, um, a big thing-
[00:10:33] Another component of this, a lot of the time, is creativity coaching talking before the call, like getting back to creativity as an adult, right? There’re so many people who, like, loved to sing or write or paint or dance. Now, they're just super disconnected from that and they think that’s just a kid thing, But, I love The Artists Way and that's like my Bible.
[00:10:58] I love that book. And I really believe that everybody's creative and everybody benefits from having a creative practice. You know, whether you share that with the world or not. And then there's also the part of my background in social justice. And then that's kind of the other part of my work and the thing you read, “speak your truth to power,” right?
[00:11:24] So trying to kind of break down the structure of having so many voices of cis, White men. And, you know, I work with them and non-binary, mostly professionals, to try to help them connect more with their truth and their voice; getting more comfortable with sharing that in the workplace or just on the public sphere.
[00:11:55] Randi: I, I love that. I love how you you've sort of married all of these things from your background and your, I guess, previous lives, whether it was when you were a kid, right? Doubling down on that; where did this come from? Is this something that evolved over time, with all of these different experiences and lives you've lived? Or is it something that you feel like you always had when you were a kid, to care this much about others? Or, I guess maybe a little, both?
[00:12:27] Juniper: Yes, both. So, when I was a kid, I was the kind of kid who was just so disturbed by the wrongness of everything. Right. Just like-
Randi: I get it.
Juniper: So bothered as a kid, right? And I always sang songs. I always made up songs and they were often really dramatic. Like, I was carrying so much weight of the world from a really young age. And I have memories from when I was two. Like, I had a song that I wrote about China because there was a bunch of, there was, it was 1989 when I was two in China. Right. Tons of social unrest.
[00:13:08] I caught wind somehow of something on the news, and I had a song about China and, you know. And I played these games where I was dying. I was always dying in my game and everyone's like, “Oh, she's going to be an actress.” Right? But no, I ended up
Randi: You ended up caring a lot about what was going on.
[00:13:28] Juniper: I just cared so much. Exactly. So, another part of my story is that I'm in recovery and I'm sober. And another- so, when I was a teenager, like I found weed and alcohol. And I was just like, cool, I can chill for a second. I don't have to worry about everything, right? There’re so many people in recovery who care too much. Right. And that, and a lot of people kind of reach for external substances to kind of quell that passion.
[00:13:58] Randi: Like try to fit in with everyone else, who's just telling them to chill, right? Just tone it down. Yeah.
Juniper: Right. And then being an empath, a lot of people in recovery are empaths and just can't take it, right? And so, and, and I, I can tend towards depression. And so, yeah, for a long time, I kind of covered up how intensely I felt about stuff with drugs and alcohol, when I was younger, because I didn't have the capacity to handle this, right? And it's taken a lot of, you know, personal growth and maturity and inner work to get to a place where I can hold all of it.
[00:14:43] Randi: Like almost harness those superpowers.
Juniper: Yeah.
Randi: I mean, that's why I started this podcast, because I got to the place, right, where I am like, “Oh wait, this is a super power that not everyone has, and it can use it to elevate voices of other people doing these amazing things like you are, so-
[00:15:02] Juniper: I feel that in my whole body just like, exactly. You know, it is a gift to be this passionate, to be this caring, to be able to feel other people to this extent, you know? It's a super power and every superpower is also, you know, an impediment, if you don't know how to use it. You know, we learned that from X-men.
Randi: Right? Totally. It's totally, yeah. What is it? That with great power comes great responsibility. And that's, and that's not just around others, right?
[00:15:38] It's with yourself, because for someone who cares so much that I feel like that's- the biggest thing is, a lot of times we end up in our own ways about it, right?
Juniper: Yeah.
Randi: There are, there are so many people who are, who are cool with mailing it in, and maybe that actually comes from their own superpower being dampened.
[00:15:58] Juniper: Absolutely. So, in the meantime, there, before I figured out how to- I mean, obviously I'm still figuring it out all the time- but before I reached a point of kind of like, okay, I know how to be this way and how to survive and not self-destruct.
[00:16:18] You know, I, I mentioned that I was an activist and that, right, came out of this deep desire to make the world a better place.
Randi: Yes.
Juniper: And, you know, my motto was “I'm in the world, change the world.” That's why I'm here. Right? The reason I'm here is to end oppression. That, you know, on the surface is a noble cause. But then there's a problem with that, which is like, I couldn't accept anything. You know, I wanted to change everything.
[00:16:52] And that being your purpose is kind of a recipe for heartbreak. There's a lot of stuff we can’t change.
Randi: Yes.
Juniper: Right?
Randi: Yeah.
Juniper: But then at the same time, there's a lot we can. And a lot of people are having a lot of trouble figuring out which is which, righ?. So now, my purpose is to connect with others and build.
[00:17:20] Randi: I love that.
Juniper: And I can do that. I can do that and I can use, you know, I can use that purpose for good on a daily basis. And, yes, I can work to change. I can work for social change and I still do do that. But, you know, the most important thing is to connect with others because what I've found myself doing back then was I really, uh, ostracized myself because there were a lot of people who I loved, who loved me that didn't see things the same way I did.
[00:17:51] And I basically, I was like, no, if you don't believe in this, right, if you don't believe in ending prisons altogether and abolishing them, then we cannot- we're going to have to part ways. I was canceling everyone left and right. And like, and, and calling meetings with like- I was in, in school and I met with the director of the school and, and had this whole platform of what was wrong with their curriculum and how there was cultural appropriation and they didn't have a faculty of color. And, you know, and like, it's not like the points were wrong.
[00:18:28] Randi: Super, super important stuff, but maybe an approach that isn't-
Juniper: It wasn't diplomatic, and it didn't take into account psychology. Right? Where if you're just taking a person and being like, “you're wrong, you're wrong, you're wrong.” They can't hear you. Right? And so, you know, and, and I'm still not the most diplomatic person, but I do know that the way that I was doing it, wasn't working. And that woman actually said to me, “Can I ask you a question? Why is it that when you
[00:19:01] see something wrong, you feel the need to change it?” And when she asked me that question, I rolled my eyes out of my head and I was like, “What?!” I, that was just like such a stupid question to me at that time, but it echoed in my head for years and it really stuck with me.
[00:19:26] And after getting sober, I actually wrote her an amends, because I did the 12 steps, and I apologized for coming at her that way.
Randi: Wow.
Juniper: Even though all of my points, I still stand behind them, she couldn't hear me. And she asked me that question that really got in my head. Why is it that I feel the need to change everything around me if it's wrong? Right? And the answer is because I care too fucking much. Right?
[00:19:58] Randi: Yeah. Yeah. That is the answer.
Juniper: But then what do we do with that?
Randi: Right. Right.
Juniper: And then that comes back to like the super power impediment thing.
Randi: Right.
Juniper: Are we sending everyone away because we care so much? And they're unacceptable to us and that anything that isn't, like, perfectly aligned with our values is unacceptable?
[00:20:18] I don't know. I don't know if anyone listening to this, like, is going to be, if this is going to be resonating with anyone, but that was my journey. Right? Like really having to figure out like, okay, I need to value connection over my sense of right and wrong because I might not be right. But at the end of the day, like this is another person in front of me, who I could build with and instead I'm on my high horse. I need to get off my high horse, figure out where they're coming from. Yeah.
[00:20:49] Randi: That's so interesting because that kind of touches the, sort of the thought that there's your truth, right? And then there's their truth. But they're both the truth, based on, you know, life experience, and circumstance, and so many other things. So that's, that's throwing that psychology of it into the mix, right?
[00:21:14] Juniper: Yes. Yeah. And I love that, I love that you brought it back to that, to their truth and your truth. And I was seeing him up recently, like, and with your questions again, I was thinking like, how did this show up in my story? Because I, I haven't been afraid of speaking, right?
[00:21:37] That's not my story. I'm not afraid of speaking. And for me, the breakdown happens in getting out of my head and into my heart. And connecting with my heart and speaking from there.
Randi: That's so good.
Juniper: And I'll just like, I'll yammer about my truth till you won't listen to anymore. Right? Like, always have. I've never been afraid of just, like, speaking truth to power and going to the director of the school and whatever.
[00:22:07] But, a lot of the time I'm spouting, like, stuff that I've read and stuff that I believe. And I'm not like actually connecting with my heart and that's, and honestly, that was a huge thing for me, discovering breathwork, you know? And, and doing this other healing work that I've done, including the 12 steps and emotional freedom technique. I did all sorts of stuff, you know, trying to like get out of my head and into my heart.
[00:22:35] Randi: Well, that's so cool because it's, it's almost like, so you care so much and you were trying to change the world. Right? And, and that's a lot. That's a lot. So, you know, you, you cared so much. I mean, you still give a fuck, right, but you were in a million different directions at once trying to save the world.
[00:22:57] And then it, it sounds like it wasn't until you dove into your own internal world, where you were able to, to really focus where, where the best place to zero in on that energy you have that is so caring, right? You're sort of starting with cleaning up your side of the street, I guess, for a cheesy cliché.
[00:23:24] That's really cool. And then, ended up focusing on this, this voice embodiment and breath work. What is it about the breath work that you feel like helps you get to that place where you can, you and others, I guess, can, can sort of channel themselves and like ground themselves?
Juniper: Yeah. Breathing in general, right?
[00:23:48] Breathwork in general, the big umbrella term. Which is anything you're doing with your breath, basically. Breathing in general is so important. And I've just been thinking about, I mean, this is the theme, one of the many themes of 2020. If you think, think about it, the corona virus attacks our respiratory tract, the fires in California, how hard it is to breathe right now, Black Lives Matter, George Floyd.
[00:24:18] Randi: “I can’t breathe.” Yeah.
Juniper: You know, Eric Garner couldn't breathe, like so many. Like the fact that that is the way that institution of policing is often choosing to kill people. So, I've just been like sitting and kind of the reality of, of all of these kinds of fronts, where breathing is kind of contentious and endangered. And we have this really shallow breathing culture.
[00:24:48] We have this, this hunched over, shallow, chest-breathing, mouth-breathing culture. I do it too. I mean, uh, yeah.
Randi: Bad, bad habit for me.
Juniper: Yeah. And, but, um, so, you know, you've got like, especially right now when so many people are at home with their screen, right. They’re hunched over, like breathing through their mouth, into their chest, these little breaths.
[00:25:14] So, just taking a big, deep breath in, through the nose all the way down into the belly. Right? And then slowly out, like, it changes your physiology. You know, now it's circulates the blood, it massages the internal organs. I mean, like there's, the list is a mile long of the things that it does and the things that aren't happening when we aren't doing that.
[00:25:41] And so, any breathwork, even just five minutes of slow, deep breathing through the nose, will change your day. It's a head change. So, breath work, the kind of breath work that I do is a lot more than that. It's very, um, it can be very intense. It's like - it can be a life changing experience. I remember the first time I did breathwork, it was a life changing experience.
[00:26:08] Physiologically, it's got all sorts of benefits and I won't go into the science, because I'm not the one to do that. But you know, on an emotional and mental level, it's clarifying. Right? Basically, what happens – here, I'll just like, describe breathwork. Basically, what happens is we start with a meditation and then we start doing part breath, which is an inhale through the mouth, into the belly, and then an inhale through the mouth, into the chest and then out the mouth.
[00:26:44] Okay. So, it's like this big breath, because it's [demonstrates, by inhaling], right? So, you take two for every exhalation.
Randi: Oh, wow.
Juniper: Yeah. So, and we breathe like that for about 25 minutes.
Randi: Oh, wow.
Juniper: Lying down with your eyes closed. Yeah. So that's, that's what we're talking about. When we're talking about like the breath work, we do it to music, so I'll make a playlist and, um, I'll try to kind of channel what the session is going to be about and make the music relevant to that.
[00:27:23] And then I kind of guide just through spoken things, whatever comes through to me in the, during that time, I kind of guide throughout. And then at the end, there's a release and a meditation. And during the breath work, the thing that happens is that just like emotions start coming at you. Right. And you just start feeling, you start feeling stuff, which can be scary to people.
[00:27:50] And, and so that's why it's important to, to the first few times, at least to do it with a practitioner in a safe container, because a lot of time people are like, “what's happening?” Um, it can be overwhelming at first, but then, you know, all you have to do is lie there and breathe and kind of get through it.
[00:28:11] And you might cry, right? Like crying is very common and very encouraged. I encourage people to make sounds. I encourage people to yell or say words that come up or just moan. Whatever. Right? And this is the voice opening.
Randi: Wow.
Juniper: And then at the end of it, it's, it's like, you've kind of been through this journey and then you rest, and we do a meditation and it really kind of like seals it all up.
[00:28:43] And then I encourage journaling or a creative practice of some sort, or like a bath or just, you know, something to kind of- self-nourishing after.
Randi: Gotcha.
Juniper: So that's, that's what it is. And
[00:28:58] Randi: That sounds amazing and vulnerable, but also, like you said, sounds life-changing.
[00:29:04] Juniper: Yes. I think a lot of people are hesitant to describe it because maybe it sounds scary, but then that makes it so mysterious.
[00:29:13] And then people don't want to try it because they don't even know what it is. And so, I like to describe it, but I will say, I think very few people experience it as scary in the moment. I think the idea of it,
[00:29:24] Randi: The idea. Yeah.
[00:29:26] Juniper: But when you're in it, it’s just happening. And I saw one article that said a breathwork is like an adult temper tantrum.
[00:29:35] Randi: Oh, how funny.
[00:29:36] Juniper: I thought that was an interesting one. I don't think that it's common to feel the level of anger associated with the temper tantrum, but I do think it's like, yeah, it's this big emotion rush, right? It's just like [yells] all the things. Right? And a lot of us have a lot of repressed emotion. Right.
[00:29:56] Like maybe for years, years’ worth of repressed emotions so…
[00:30:00] Randi: …that we don't even know about.
[00:30:02] Juniper: We don't even know about it, I mean, maybe we know a little bit?
[00:30:08] Randi: We probably know and we're trying to just like put that away under the rug somewhere.
[00:30:11] Juniper: Yeah. So, right. That's the part that is scary to think about doing, but when you're in it, it's like, nah, it's just happening. It's like, Yeah.
[00:30:24] Randi: Okay. That sounds cool. That sounds awesome.
Juniper: Yeah. It's like when you're scared to like, I don't know, skydive. I've never done that. I'm way too scared to skydive, but people who talk about it, they're like, “Oh, it was so scary. But then I did it and I was like; I'm just doing it!” and you know? And that's way scarier than breathwork though, so that's a bad example.
[00:30:44] Randi: No, that is- I have someone who swears by a skydiving now. Like I know someone now who, who tried it for the first time in the last few months and is like, “it's all I want to do with people when they come visit, because it will change their lives. And so, like, I feel like that, I don't know, I imagine that someone who's been touched by breath work - especially like you - who, you know
[00:31:11] what it's done for you, what you've seen and do for others- that I can only imagine what it's like to want to just be like, “Alright, you guys, I'm telling you this is going to change your life.”
[00:31:23] Juniper: Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So maybe, maybe skydiving is a good analogy.
[00:31:30] Randi: Can we, for a second, can we go back to everybody staring at their screens and being hunched over like I am right now?
[00:31:38] Juniper: Yeah.
Randi: And, and why, why do we-
[00:31:43] breathing is such, I mean, it's an involuntary thing that we have to do to stay alive, but why do we forget? How, like, why do we forget to breathe? Like that's so crazy. Or, we forget to breathe in a way that serves us really.
[00:31:57] Juniper: Right. Okay. So, the main reason is, um, have you heard of like, you know, fight or flight mode? Like terminology, right? Survival mode. So, when we talk about the autonomic nervous system, the sympathetic nervous system is what's engaged when you're in fight or flight mode. When you're in survival mode comes from stress.
[00:32:21] And then, um, the parasympathetic nervous system is what's engaged when we're relaxed. When, when we're sleeping, feeling pleasure, it's, you know, hopefully engaged when we're eating. That's why it's so important, like, sit down and chew your food and not be like eating while walking or driving, you know?
[00:32:40] ‘Cause your digest it's better if you're relaxed. Right. It's okay. So, we've got these two modes, right? And in our society- So, evolutionarily the sympathetic nervous system survival mode was meant for escaping from predators. Basically, escaping from predators. Yeah. Yeah.
[00:33:05] I mean, I’m sure there are other reasons too, right? But like for the most part,
Randi: But mostly, don't get eaten.
Juniper: For the most part, right. So, you know, you've got a run. Your breathing gets more shallow when you're in that mode and a bunch of other things happen too, right? Like when someone like pees themselves and they're really scared.
Randi: Your body starts doing things. Yeah.
[00:33:26] Juniper: Yeah. That's, well, that's ‘cause your body's like, you're going to be a lot faster if you get rid of this pee, you know? Like-
Randi: Is that really why?
Juniper: Totally.
Randi: Wow.
Juniper: Yes. Yeah. Because like holding in your pee and running at the same time; much more challenging. Just get rid of the pee that- we're in survival mode.
Randi: We don't have to worry about the pee.
[00:33:45] Juniper: Yeah, exactly. There's a bunch of things.
[00:33:49] Randi: Which is genius, but also not how we want to be living every day, right?
[00:33:52] Juniper: Right. It should be like a few times a lifetime. Yeah. And so, yeah. And exactly, and that's how we're living every day. In our societies to some extent, right? And then, and then trauma compounds that, right? When we get traumatized, then they're even more things that trigger survival mode, but just, you know, the average American lives a lot of the time is in fight or flight mode. And there's tons of sociological reasons for that, right? I mean, like
Randi: Right.
Juniper: We live in a culture of stress, overworking is seen as admirable, and less sleep is seen as
[00:34:38] Randi: Productivity.
[00:34:40] Juniper: Yeah. “Oh my God. I only got like four hours of sleep over the last, like five days, like, oh my God. You're right.”
Randi: “I've been working so hard.” Yeah. Yeah.
[00:34:48] So that's very unhealthy and contributes to this. And then also, like there are actual a lot of things that are really scary. Right? In our society right now, there are a lot of threats to our survival, real or perceived. So that is the long short answer to why we generally breathe that way. And like more in work.
[00:35:14] “I'm like, I gotta get this thing done.”
Randi: Right. Yeah. Right.
Juniper: It's also just, we- do we even have time to stop and take a deep breath? Right? And computer posture is part of that. Like, I mean, I really think that well, society has been built around being in a sympathetic, engaged state.
[00:35:40] Randi: I, I don't know if I could argue with that.
[00:35:43] Juniper: And this is why like, people like the Nap Ministry on Instagram are so important, right? I'm like, so many people are kind of like taking up this cause of the importance of relaxation, and I think that used to be seen as like a very white, a white lady privileged way to be. And now there's all these people of color speaking out like, “no, for, for people of color rest is resistance.”
[00:36:10] Randi: Gosh, it's even more important, right? Yeah.
[00:36:12] Juniper: Yeah. I think that that's so important and really- I'm really relieved that that is a thing in 2020, because when I was living in New York and burning myself out as a political activist, I could not figure out a way to take care of myself. I knew it was important.
[00:36:34] I could feel myself fizzling. I could feel the stress and anxiety of like constant police repression and of, you know, court cases hanging over my head. And so many people relying on me and like, I could feel all of that stress eating away at my nervous system. And I knew I had to do something, but I couldn't figure out what to do.
[00:36:56] And I would try to go to like this hot yoga class that my friend went to on the Upper East Side and I'd get there and it just be all these, you know, like really strung out rich white ladies, like, “okay, let's get this in. I got to get to my Pilates class!” Right. Like really? It was like, what are you doing?
[00:37:16] And then also there was kind of this culture of denial and wellness. And we're talking, this is like 2012, right. Where it was kind of like, okay, leave your worries at the door and just come in here. You have 90 minutes to really relax and just forget about all your problems. This is you. This is you time.
[00:37:37] Right? And I was like, I'm not comforted by that. I don't. I don't feel like a culture of denial is if to my healing, right? That's not the thing that's going to help me unwind my nervous system. I need acceptance.
[00:37:56] Randi: Good vibes only, right? Like. That whole ,yeah.
[00:38:00] Juniper: I don’t have any good vibes today, like my friend is in jail. Like, you know, it's just like, no, I don’t have that and stop imposing that on me. And why am I paying you to tell me to just forget about the real shit in my life? Right?
Randi: And, and like, just, just be cool.
Juniper: And if I feel that way as a white woman, then I can only imagine, right, how people who don't even see themselves represented in those, in the leadership or the teachers or the other clients.
[00:38:33] Like I, you know, there's no way that, that, and go on in an environment like that for most of us.
Randi: Yeah.
Juniper: So that was so much of why I wanted to, I mean, I left New York, like, I need to go figure out how to help people with self-care. I needed to go figure out how to facilitate the healing circle that I need.
[00:39:01] And it took me a lot of years in between to really do that. But now I have this offering that I do once a month that we'll talk about, but like that is the healing circle that I needed that doesn't deny my experience and doesn't deny that my beloved state that is on fire and that, you know, the old growth redwoods that I played in as a child that my friends got married, that are burning down right now, you know, like I can't forget about that reality in service of calming down.
[00:39:31] That's like oxymoronic to me.
Randi: Yeah.
Juniper: I need to like, hold that to calm down. I need to breathe in to that reality. And incorporate it into my body. It's true. It's not going away. So, my healing work needs to be about incorporation. It needs to be about acceptance. Right. And that's like, I don't know. I don't know. I don't understand why the wellness industry doesn't get that, but it really feels like it doesn't.
[00:40:02] Randi: Yeah, I, Oh my gosh. I feel like I relate to that so hard, because I lived in LA for a long time and worked in film and television and it was that same sort of like crazy grind and everyone trying to keep up with everyone else. Right. And, and all kinds of other stuff going on, but then I left and wanted to help other people more.
[00:40:27] And not to say that there aren't people, you know, in whatever industries helping other people, but for me, and my experience with it, I was just like, what I'm doing feels really selfish. I need to go somewhere where I can have room to help other people, but also acknowledge what happened in that crazy, like, previous life. Like you were saying. I mean, that's, for me, that was partially like the Me Too thing, which, which is for so many people. Right. But, but just that we're not going to ignore the thing anymore.
[00:41:04] Juniper: Right.
Randi: We're going to talk about it.
Juniper: Right.
Randi: Because ignoring doesn't really work and suppresses a lot of things. Cool. So…
[00:41:14] Mindset. What kind of mindset do you feel like you have, or you try to embody to be able to, to care as much as you do? I know we kind of talked about this before with being spread sort of thin and your caring and then zeroing down. What is the mindset that you have to have to be able to do that and be effective and feel fulfilled, I guess, in, in your caring?
[00:41:40] Juniper: Oh yeah, that's a great question because yeah, like when left to my own devices, without doing inner work, I'm just, my energy is just all over the place. I'm like lashing out at people. I'm saying things that I regret; I'm doing things that are self-destructive, right? Like, and I don't blame that on, on myself or my upbringing, but I do blame that on our society, you know, and like for all of the aforementioned reasons, right? Like for people who care too much, this is not a safe place. Right? And we've got to do a lot for ourselves to be okay.
[00:42:25] I'd say I need to connect every day with my higher self/nature, the universe. I need to go. Like, I need to go inside and get out of my, get out of my head. Right? Which maybe sounds like a contradiction, but the only way out is in, you know. So, I need to get out of my head and into my heart and connect with like the larger energy, whether that's - for anyone who's listening - whether that's God or the tree outside your window.
[00:43:04] Or your connection with your community or just, I don't know, just your higher self.
Randi: Something sort of bigger than you.
Juniper: I was trying not to say like something greater than yourself, because that's the very like 12-steppy language, but God, that was fucking revolutionary for me. Like, I didn’t get it. I think I was trying to do you do that with actual, with the actual idea of revolution.
[00:43:34] Right? I was trying to do the idea of art. I was trying to do that with the idea of like a really great partner who I could put all of my hope in. Like, I see also like so many of us do then I was, yeah, I was always trying to like, put that, yeah, on an idea. It can't be put on an idea. It has to be put on an energy.
[00:43:56] Right. And so that's why like, God is the easiest shortcut for that. I have to connect with, with that.
Randi: Connected, like a connected mindset would sort of bring you out of- I guess, that sort of leads into the next question I had for you is a pitfall, what's a pitfall for someone who cares too much? And it sounds like that's everything you were just talking about, right?
[00:44:19] Juniper: Like, yeah. My whole life has pitfalls, right? Like codependency, addiction, depression. Just like moving; moving across the country, moving across the country again, moving cross country again, right? Like just trying to like hate myself or find myself or both. Yeah. God, there's so many, there's so many pitfalls and really they're the coping mechanisms that were offered by society. They are.
[00:44:47] Randi: That's huge. Coping for caring so much though. Coping for giving a fuck is like, kind of crazy if you think about it.
Juniper: Oh my God. Yeah, it is. But again, super power or impediment, right?
Randi: Right.
Juniper: If you're letting it rule you, if you're letting it run you, then that is not your super power. That's just your energies out of control.
[00:45:10] And it's all over on everybody else, you know? I've always been a journaler. And I think that the worst, the worst parts of my life were when I, I wasn't journaling regularly. I need that. I need that release. And then I also need to be able to look back at it and figure out where I've been. And like, and I mentioned The Artist's Way, but I think that that's such a good tool for people who care too much.
[00:45:40] I just think that like, even if, I don't know, I feel like all of us who care too much are creative in some way. We have this extra energy and we don't know what to do with it. And putting it into creativity of any kind is golden, right? Then it's just like, look, I made a thing, you know, and, and it's like, I didn't like waste my night writhing on the floor, which also
[00:46:08] sometimes needs to happen, but like-
Randi: Totally.
Juniper: You know, but like someone said the other day, “I was having a kitchen floor moment.” I was like, got you. Kitchen floor moment.
Randi: Been there. Yeah.
Juniper: Why the kitchen? I don't know. And then, but I think that, like, a way out of like having too many kitchen floor moments is like, okay, I'm just going to go make something.
[00:46:32] And it just gets you out of yourself. Like, turn on a record. Say, “I'm going to doodle until this record ends,” and just do that, you know?
Randi: Things get flowing, right? They like, yeah. That energy is moving instead of stagnant in this, like, I don't know, frustration, right? Y
Juniper: Yeah. Let's see.
[00:46:54] Randi: Let’s see, who is someone who has influenced or impacted you, in a good way?
Juniper: Okay. Yes, that is a good question. I always have trouble with that question, like the question of like heroes and stuff, and it's always changing, but someone who's really important to me right now, says every femme person in the world, is Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez.
Randi: Dream girl.
Juniper: She's like, you know, of course, like the second, she stepped on the public stage,
[00:47:33] I was like, yes, this woman. But more and more the leadership that she shows; I can't think of anyone in my lifetime who's done that. I cannot think of a single person who I was like, “Oh my God. Not only is she saying what's in my head, but she's standing by it.”
Randi: Right?
[00:47:58] Yeah. She doesn't, she's not wavering. Right? She's just, she's standing up and she's saying it, and it's real. When the rest of us are like- can’t.
Juniper: Yes. I mean, speaking of someone who is speaking their truth to power so authentically, and like she's got the long game, like it's in her face, you know? She's-
Randi: Yes.
[00:48:24] Juniper: Like, she's here for it and, oh God, I really hope she's taking care of herself.
[00:48:30] I really hope that the people that love her taking care of her. I really hope that like, she takes time to pamper herself. I know that it like, because I know enough people like her, that I know that it's not, it's not baked into her politics to do that. She doesn't, she doesn't believe that it's as important as her other work.
[00:48:55] And I just pray that, you know, she does it anyway and that the people around her are helping her to do that and facilitating it, because that's the thing, like she's got such a uphill battle. She's got more and more people joining her though, you know, like the squad is growing. Yeah. So that's, I dunno, yeah.
[00:49:18] Randi: What a great one. That’s awesome. I love that.
Juniper: I can’t remember ever saying a politician before, but yeah. That's yeah.
Randi: I love it. I love it. And right now, I can't think of anyone else that I like- I, I agree. Yes. Do you have one piece of advice for anyone listening that they can contemplate or take action on?
[00:49:43] Juniper: Do inner work. Don't let your fear of your darkness stop you from doing inner work. There’re so many ways it can look. You know, right now a lot of people are doing anti-racist work. For White and White-passing people, like, that is the inner work. Not to say that there's like, I don't know. I don't want people to think of it as like, “I'm doing self-care.
[00:50:11] I'm doing anti-racism work.” Right? It isn't- cause anti-racisim work isn't about us, so-
Randi: Right.
Juniper: It's a little tricky to throw that in there, but it's definitely shadow work and it's so important.
Randi: It’s work.
Juniper: But then I'd also say if you're going to start doing anti-racism work, also do some other inner work.
[00:50:32] That's more nourishing, self-care, like balance that, cause again, long game. But so, like The Artist's Way is a program that you can do. You can buy the book and do that. And that is amazing inner work.
Randi: It's so good.
Juniper: Okay, you've done it?!
[00:50:49] So, you’re reminding me of it, and I want to get back to it now. Because a musician, a musician friend of mine, she told me about that book years ago and like swears by it. So now you're reminding me. And I want to dive in, along with my anti-racist work.
[00:51:08] Juniper: Yes. Yeah, I think it's a great compliment to anti-racist work, to be doing The Artist's Way. And then breath work, of course. And 12 step programs; there are 12 step programs for everything, and I just wish everyone would do a 12-step program because, and like, I know that there there's so much stigma against that, but I just had no idea.
[00:51:32] I had no idea. I would have, like me two years ago, I would have rolled my eyes at myself, which is like my signature move. But I just can't believe like how transformative it was to really look at myself that rigorously. I really, really looked at myself in ways that I just think if everyone would do it-
[00:52:00] Randi: we would all give more fucks. Hopefully about other people.
Juniper: About other people, exactly! Yeah, I mean, and that's another thing about the going back to the breathing and the shallow breathing- when we're breathing shallowly, we are in our lizard brain.
Randi: Oo.
Juniper: Okay. So, you've heard that term, right? Like lizard.
Rand: I have, but please elaborate.
Juniper: It’s like the back of the brain where you're operating from fear because you're in survival mode. And so, you're like, “what do I do? Do I jump off the cliff, or do I jump into the river?!”
Randi: Or do I fight? Yeah.
[00:52:34] Juniper: Yeah. Yeah. You're just like, “Do I run?! Do I fight?!” You're making decisions like with that part of your brain, your survival part of your brain. And it's really fucking hard to get along with people when you're making decisions from your lizard brain. It doesn't have the capabilities.
[00:52:54] Randi: Well, you don't have that connection. Right?
Juniper: Right.
Randi: The connection piece.
Juniper: Absolutely. No, you're just in it for you. You're just in it to survive, and that's going to look really ugly interpersonally. And that's why we say things we don't mean when we're fighting. “I didn't mean that. Why the hell did I say that?” Right. Like, “I don't actually believe that about you.” I said it out of, I said it cause my lizard brain was talking. So, when we breathe deeply and activate our parasympathetic nervous system, we are engaging our mammalian brain, right? Like, the front part of our brain where we're, and again, I'm not a scientist, this is purely anecdotal science.
[00:53:38] Randi: Hey, you have the disclaimer in there, so it's cool.
Juniper: Yes.
Randi: Run with it.
Juniper: But it's true. I mean, the science does back this up. It's just, I'm probably not explaining it in the most scientific way, but we're in the front of our brain. We can make decisions. Complicated decisions with nuance. But we can only get into that brain if we get out of survival mode.
[00:54:02] And the fastest way to get out of survival mode is to change our breathing. And I'm not entirely sure why I started talking about that just now.
Randi: There it is, folks. There it is; breathing. It is the key to everything, so that we could stop being iguanas and start being humans.
[00:54:27] Juniper: I’ve got to write that down. That's some serious, a marketing genius you just gave me. Stop being an iguana. But I like iguanas.
Randi: The only part of me that still wants to be a lizard is the part that wants to lay in the sun because I'm always cold. But other than that, like, I'm all about being human.
Juniper. Okay. Yeah, you can do both.
Randi: All right. A tip on staying sane during lockdown. Ready? Go.
[00:54:54] Juniper: I just gave so many tips.
Randi: You did. I know, let's just skip that one. Let's skip it. Let's skip it.
Juniper: We need more sleep because we're stressed out. Things are scary. And so, we're doing our deep breathing. We're journaling, we're doing our inner work and then we're like, “well, why am I still so tired?” It's because you actually need more sleep.
[00:55:16] Randi: Alright. Two ways you just made me feel a lot better. One, I've been sleeping a lot more and feeling totally guilty about it. Two, I just asked you to give another tip after you gave 12,000 tips and you came up with something else so, superpowers.
Juniper: Superpowers.
[00:55:39] Randi: Alright, last question for you. One thing you've never done that you would like to try? We already know it's not skydiving.
Juniper: You know, I used to want to try skydiving and I was going to do it for my 30th birthday, and that was three years ago. And I just think I missed- I missed the window. I just don't know.
[00:56:03] Randi: You're sort of- now your mortality is hanging over you.
Juniper: But you know what I want to try? I've never been whitewater rafting. I think I'd really like that.
Randi: That sounds fun. I've done like the easy, like, mini golf course version of that, I feel like.
Juniper: Oh, what’s that. That sounds nice.
Randi: It's actually, I think it was on the American river, just outside of Sacramento. It was really fun. It was really fun.
[00:56:31] Juniper: I love tubing, but only for like half an hour and then my whole, like, middle of my body gets so cold and I can't do it, but no one just wants to go tubing for half an hour. So, I want to try the baby, the baby rafting.
[00:56:48] The rafting would be good then. Dip a toe in if you're getting hot.
Juniper: Right.
Randi: But otherwise, you don't have to freeze in, you know, the melted snow water.
Juniper: Yeah.
Randi: Alright. Juniper Waller. Tell us more about where we can find out more about you; website, social media, any, any stuff you're working on right now that you want to tell people about?
[00:57:13] Juniper: Yes. Thank you. I would love to. So, my Instagram is @voicebodyspirit, and that is my main spot right now. I have been doing weekly grounding meditations. I been doing some conversations with other people. Oh, I just did a conversation with Onica from our thought leadership course, this morning, and she talked about her experience doing breathwork with me. So that was cool. But anyways, so my Instagram @voicebodyspirit and then every second Saturday of every month is Breathwork for Collective Liberation, which is the thing I was talking about earlier.
[00:57:56] Where I was saying it's the healing circle that I have always really wanted and needed that is not in denial about what's going on in the world. It's a come-as-you-are healing circle over Zoom. And, um, I would love to see people there and the registration for that is in the bio of my Instagram. One-on-ones, of course, one on one vocal embodiment and breathwork sessions.
[00:58:23] Randi: That sounds badass. I am excited to learn more about both of those. Awesome. Alright. Well, thank you so much for joining me today, Juniper. This was so much fun, enlightening, and I'm so glad that you were able to share your super powers with us today. And thank you for giving a fuck.
Juniper: Yes, thank you for giving a fuck! All the fucks!
[00:58:48] Randi: Okay. So, let's do a little episode recap. I, 100% related to what Juniper was saying about some of her clients feeling weird about their voices, because of something negative someone said about them. Though. I wouldn't have known or thought to call that trauma. So, that's interesting and makes a lot of sense.
I remember a few things. So, there was definitely people at school that said my voice sounded like mouse, it was so high pitched and that made me super self-conscious just for a long time. And, and I remember when it became sort of a cool thing to record your voice on, on your landline, voicemail machine.
[00:59:37] And I asked my mom, if I could do that and she let me, and I recorded it and I was mortified at how squeaky my voice sounded, especially after people had made fun of that at school. So really, I was scared of what other people would think when they heard it. I begged her to erase it and someone else do it, or she do it over, and she liked it and she wouldn't let me, so that was on our, our voicemail machine, I think, until we moved and didn't have that landline anymore.
[01:00:18] So, I guess I kinda got used to it? And then I do remember other people too, having, I guess, trauma around their voice, thinking that they couldn't sing, for a long time. At the elementary school that I went to, it was common for everyone - I think in fifth grade or sixth grade. Fifth grade, I think- to, um, sort of try out or audition for the concert choir.
[01:00:45] Everyone did it, I think. And if you didn't make it, you got put into a different singing group. But everyone, sort of, had the idea that if, you know, that was the bad singing group. The singing group for people who couldn't sing. So, I remember some, some kids who were in that group who were very embarrassed about it and probably held on to that trauma for a long time, thinking that an expert or a choir teacher told them that they couldn't sing.
[01:01:18] I'm pretty curious about digging deeper into this and, and I'm probably going to reach out to Juniper about it. And also, as far as breath work, it would be cool to do a deeper dive with that too. I definitely do some shallow chest-breathing and sometimes I even find myself holding my breath entirely, and that cannot be the greatest.
[01:01:42] Yeah. I also loved that Juniper brought up the potential pitfall that can happen with people who care a lot about a lot of things, and that's that we need to make sure that empathy stays as superpower and doesn't become an impediment. Truly caring means we're still connected to others. I like how she pointed out that when we stay connected, that's when we have the potential to build together.
[01:02:10] And I think if we really care, that's, that's the whole point. Speaking of building bridges and building together, Juniper also mentioned doing anti-racist work, which is a lifelong, sort of, shadow work in one way or another. And it's not easy, but it's also so necessary for White and White-passing people who want to deeply give a fuck.
[01:02:39] And the book that Juniper mentioned as a great way to balance out that anti-racist work through self-nurturance and self-care, that was called The Artist’s Way by Julia Cameron. And I'm thinking I might have to pick that up again. You can find information about all of the above in this episode, show notes.
[01:03:00] Alright. Until next time, keep giving a fuck, keep being you, and remember there's no such thing as caring too much.